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(For some reason I thought I'd clicked post on this at lunchtime but it's been sitting in my browser waiting for me and I nearly lost it all - it should go before dazzyweb's post in the order of things, but that post serves to confirm that everyone has their own opinions and that we're not all clones ). - - - - - - - - - - - - I've only skim-read bits of this topic because I disagree with much of what you have said lisandi (everyone will have slightly different opinions of course ), but I think maybe reading the other threads on comparing PW to WP/Joomla/etc will help understand why you may be getting replies that confuse you. This one especially where from start to end where some people share your views to some degree, but specifically the post from ryan that I linked directly to: https://processwire.com/talk/topic/7565-making-pw-more-userfriendly/?p=73748 I don't think anyone's being obstinate in not wanting to change interfaces drastically, but the very short version of the counter-argument to your points is that not all CMS' have the same audience a more user-friendly interface is subjective (that thread above proves that) and the end user in theory should just be managing content, not modules/plugins/themes if the person/company who installed the CMS has done their job properly but of course it depends what kind of site you are building and who it's for Whilst nobody is ignoring these conversations completely, being the "zillionth-and-one" person to post a lot of the same stuff suggests having not read the other topics, and perhaps asking for change that simply isn't happening for good reasons as mentioned in one of those topics. If you understand ProcessWire and the infinite number of directions the front-end can go in whilst it doesn't make any assumptions out of the box, you will see that you simply cannot have one-click installs for frontend modules that will work with a theming system, or a library of themes that could even work from one site to the next. That said, it is relatively simple to convert any HTML template to ProcessWire if you are willing to learn (and there is an element of learning in any system). There is nothing about this that will spell the doom for ProcessWire that you keep mentioning and that is the part I disagree most strongly with. There has been rapid growth here these past few years and many success stories that prove your statements about digging ProcessWire's grave wrong. The majority of us (and those countless others who don't participate on the forums) are making a decent living using ProcessWire in some way to make that happen. There is no desire from the majority for ProcessWire to be the "one-click-install king" and rightly so - it is a more flexible system than the others the way it is and, if used correctly, can help you build bespoke websites without limitations quicker than other systems with interfaces that are easier for customers to use (you can build some really intuitive admin template layouts with just a few minutes' work and I would be happy to share in another thread if I get time). That's not to say that the blog module and others aren't worthwhile efforts. They do add a level of accessibility that you are talking about, however it is not the primary focus of the project and the project will not fade into obscurity by staying true to its current path - to suggest that is silly. On the other hand, it is silly for you to mention we should start digging ProcessWire's grave and equally silly for me to say otherwise. In ten years' time will anyone be using Facebook or Wordpress any more? Will "normal" websites still be a relevant marketing platform or will everything be mobile or displayed on a watch? Who knows - the point is that technology moves on and ProcessWire is a very modern bit of kit that is not trying to be like other systems based on older ways of thinking and legacy code. Will this mean that less techy people will use one of those other systems for a simple blog? Sure, it almost certainly will, but if you want a blog and lots of themes then use Wordpress - we're all for people using the right tool for the job and it won't always be ProcessWire (but for us, most of the time, of the time it is ). ProcessWire will do just fine continuing down the path it is on. User feedback is welcome (I'm just the forum admin by the way, so I'm speaking for myself and not the wider project) but no project will incorporate every suggestion, no matter how often some may arise, if it doesn't fit with the goal of the project or its intended audience - in this caseit is those people willing to learn a little more than in other systems if they want to build a site for themselves. The audiences are a little different - call it "the thinking person's CMS with endless possibilities" if you like, and assuming that's not too offensive a tagline

Since I recognized a remarkable overflow of my trash bin I made a small module which auto delete pages sustainably from the trash after a period which can be set in module settings. PW modules: http://modules.processwire.com/modules/cronjob-empty-trash/ Github: https://github.com/kixe/CronjobEmptyTrash

Just my little contribution, and for a change, I fancy being a bit annoying. ProcessWire is NOT Wordpress or Joomla It is not in direct competition with those platforms, but is meant to be something far more versatile and powerful for the professional user, yet open enough that the less knowledgeable user can learn and get their head round it in a way they enjoy and can find beneficial. The mistake, in my mind, that has been made in all zillion and one discussions about this is that they all start with making a comparison between the Drumlapress user base and the ProcessWire user base. They are different solutions in a different marketplace. If you want to make a comparison, choose the correct marketplace: Modx, Expression Engine, Liferay, even and loads of others which are about DEVELOPING solutions, not gluing them together. And when it comes to usability, when I used Joomla, I spent a huge amount of time making sure that clients could NOT update modules, user permissions and all the other things that would break the site. Trouble was, even with the new persmissions systems, that still wasn't properly possible. This "successful" application turned out to be inflexible, bloated and not fit for the modern application developer. Our job, as developers, is to create a solution for our clients that allows them to update those bits that fit with their skill set and their needs. They are experts on their products, their brand, their business structure, but not web development - that is why they hire a web developer in the first place. When I teach someone to use their PW interface, I find it a very short process. They get it immediately. There are three reasons for that: The interface is simple I remove everything they don't need or should not use I create the forms and the descriptions in a way that is completely in tune with their business process. Processwire allows me to do that. Wordpress and Joomla do not. I might not be a certificated Montessori teacher, but I have spent 35 years in advertising and communications working on high end internal and external communications solutions for some of the biggest companies in the world - Philips Electrical, British Airways, British Gas, Philips and Drew to name but a few. (Just in case anyone was wondering where my writing skills come from) Based on all that experience, I love the way I can use ProcessWire. I love the simple approach; the clearness and the focus on letting serious developers and communicators do their clients proud. I only see it getting better and stronger and more respected - but I see it doing that WITHOUT having to imitate a bunch of blogging software!

I see some misconceptions in your explanations lisandi. You're telling us about all those great themes from themeforest. Nobody prevents you from using those. If you want a wrapper for all those wordpress functions used in the templates – build one, release it as module – but that's not the job of the cms to do this. Want to have a Drupal theme, no problem. There are even lots of pure html/css themes out there to buy, which can easily be used. The only difference is, you need to have a little basic knowledge about programming. For someone building a custom website, this is a minimum requirement. But there's a reason, why there aren't themes there for ProcessWire already. It's because you build your structure and content like you need it to be. There's no way of saying: articles/sites do (need to) have a wysiwyg-field and a headline and some meta information, like wordpress does it. Without knowing the content of a page it's difficult to design/code themes, but you can still use themes if you're happy with what they offer. That's a great flexibility which comes at the cost, that you need to know to code the templatefiles in ProcessWire, which is quite easy compared to other cms's. I don't understand your reasoning, why ProcessWire would generete more jobs if people could use it more easily on their own. People don't hire a wordpress dev, because they can do his work on their own. It's because a buddy told them it's great, or they saw one of those webdesign articles. If someone doesn't know how to code, the usability of the backend matters. Means how easy can the person maintain the site, after it's build. That's no problem for ProcessWire. I would say it's far easier, because the interface is clean and consistent, while wordpress for example is most of the times cluttered with lots of different UI's from all those plugins. You mentioned, you would like to see a different categorisation in the backend. Just sort it that way. These are all just pages which can be moved around. You can add your own, too, if you need them. You say, there need's to be a list of modules. The problem is, if something is listed people will use it, no matter if they know how it works / what it exactly does. Most of the modules which are at a state, where they are supposed to be used by others are (or at least should be) in the official list here on the site. This comes with the benefit, that Ryan looks over those modules and they are less likely to break stuff drastically. These modules are all hosted on Github so everybody else is free to take a look. I can understand that that you think some modules aren't exactly enduser friendly. But most of the people here setup pages for their clients and nothing more needs to be done with the module. It just does it's job. Also I wouldn't mind a module which eases the ecommerce stuff, but that needs time or money to build.

ProcessWire (PW) is a very flexible and accommodating system. You can basically add any Front-end framework and with a little work, integrate it with PW. For me, there are no usability issues where the PW core is concerned. It does what it needs to do and if I feel it doesn't, I can easily find a solution that can be added to whatever project I'm working on. The forum is very open and accessible to anyone. People are very helpful and give of themselves. The functionality and usability that some want can indeed be added to PW. That's the great thing about PW, it's very extensible. What I don't understand is that there is nothing that is keeping others from adding these features. I, as an user will buy, support or make use of these enhanced capabilities whenever they are created/contributed. I also enjoy hearing about new use cases for PW, however I greatly hope that the core of PW remains lean, mean and powerful. I look forward to reading about how others are contributing to the PW ecosystem by adding capabilities that are not in the core. I personally believe Ryan or the core team are not responsible and have no responsibility for adding a bunch of kitchen sink features.

ProcessWire IS successful. I've not read all but think it's all kinda way off to what PW is in its philosophy and core. Sorry, but I usually am too lazy to read more than 2-3 paragraphs. You need to work on your end-user usability (me reading your post, or not).

Great idea, and I've got nothing against such a discussion -- in fact I'd love to see more of it. Still, a few comments on the specific points you've raised here: Our customers (i.e. end-users) have had very few issues with ProcessWire. In fact, ProcessWire is just about as easy-to-use as you can get. I've said before that as long as one knows how to fill in a web form, one has what it takes to update a ProcessWire site. Sure, improvements can and should be made when possible (and by no means do I want to stand in the way of any discussions about this), but to say that "ProcessWire is built with focus mainly on developers" is simply not true. On the other hand, I'm wondering if you consider installing modules something a person with "no programming knowledge" should be able to do? Part of your message seems to point to that direction, but please correct me if I'm misinterpreting you here. If that's the case, I'm not sure that I can agree -- modules that do things out of the box are a tiny fragment of all modules available from modules directory. Personally I don't consider that an important aspect, considering that we really don't want to be "the next WordPress" (or any other system that is based on the idea of building sites via stitching barely compatible collection of pre-built pieces together). Sorry, but no -- this wouldn't be great. Quite the opposite, really The whole point of the official list is to keep track of the quality of modules. I know there are modules out there that just haven't been added to the directory yet (and perhaps should), but in those cases the right path to take would be suggesting to the author that they submit their module to the directory. If they're not around to do that, that's a good reason to avoid the module altogether, as it's obviously not well maintained. Note: your idea of donation / sponsor button isn't bad, though. Not sure if that's easily doable (I'm really not familiar with such services and the way they work), but at least an option to add something like that would be nice. You can achieve this by creating new pages into Admin and moving pages related to installed Process modules under those, it's your call. Well-built Process modules won't assume that they're always installed in one location either, so moving them to another section shouldn't be a problem. .. although you're probably thinking of something larger here, and in that case, please do elaborate this further

@lisandi: I truly appreciate your enthusiasm, but clearly you and I see many things -- including what "success" really means, what ProcessWire should become, and what we'd like to do in the future -- in a very different way. Considering that, you may take my comments here with a grain of salt In a nutshell, I believe that there's a market for systems that do things differently, they don't all have to be WordPress clones, and they don't all have to do whatever it takes to become popular. In fact, I believe that trying to copy what others have done and doing what everyone is expecting -- and not thinking for yourself -- is what leads to "digging your own grave" in the long run. I don't want ProcessWire to ever become "the most popular system out there", even if it would mean "lots of jobs", if in the process it has to turn into something I can no longer respect and enjoy. I'm here exactly because I believe in what ProcessWire stands for. It's that simple, really. Those things aside, I think you've made some valid points, and we all have something to learn here. Out of interest (and assuming that I'm reading you correctly) you mentioned finding some interesting modules that aren't in our modules directory yet.. would you care to mention what and where?

I launched another processwire website for the GreggOrrAuto collection. This time for a Marina instead of autos. Uses a variation of the bootstrap template I made for greggorrauto.com. Uses the bootstrap carousel for the slider, Google maps marker module and the form templates processor module. Also using redirects module and batcher. (Redirects for the sub menu items under inventory to send the user to the search page with the correct query strings.) I used the photo/image cropping method for the grid gallery on the sales info pages to keep the photos with different heights all lined up. ie: http://www.greggorrmarine.com/products/pontoons/ Thanks!

Stay sober - can be a challenge. Go up to soho and drink guiness in the basement at The Toucan - it is a Guinness themed pub and is small, cramped, smelly and the wonderful. They also have the best collection of Irish Whiskey anywhere. If Colin still runs it (I haven't been there for years) ask for one of the Pre-1960 Middleton. It used to be £25 per shot! But gorgeous. And tell him hi. While you are up in Soho, I suggest a night at Ronnie Scotts jazz club is in order. Famous and stunning. You might want to go to Gerard Street or Lyle Street (the tiny China Town). Go to one of the smaller restaurants and have roast pork and rice or a plate of Dimm Sum. If you are very, very, very brave, there is Comptons in in compton street - they used have a really good drag cabaret, but it can feel dangerous in there. Put it this way, I am straight, but even gay friends were scared of it! https://www.facebook.com/pages/Comptons-of-Soho/157845687574555 In the same area is the French House - I used to go in there and buy large bottles of French cider and a couple of glasses. Nice atmos http://www.frenchhousesoho.com/ My FAVOURTITE dive, however, was the Blues Bar in Kingly Street, near Oxford Circus (all still in the same area). http://www.aintnothinbut.co.uk/ When I lived in central london I used to go there a couple of times a week and even played there a couple of times (when people got me drunk enough to persuade me to sing). I have had some fantastic times in there. Outside of alcohol, depending what you are into, I suggest the Tate Modern on the south bank, the National Theatre (also on the south bank) and the Globe Theatre, though that is open to the elements! (no roof). The Natural history Museum and the Science museum are still wonderful for quiet days. The Natural History is a simply spectacular building. http://www.nhm.ac.uk/ However, their website is boring - try and get some work while you are there! Food? Well, London is the food capital of Europe with some of the best restaurants - and at a high price. But there are places like Efes on great Titchfield street for great turkish food. Owned by Kassim who is a letch, but my flat was dead opposite - best flat I ever had. Also Topkapi on Marylebone high street (still the west end) https://plus.google.com/102240451418416030908/about?gl=uk&hl=en Best take-away kebab ever. Nice people too. I am a bit out of touch with the food now - Langhams and Odins were two of my favourites. Langham's is owned by Michael Cane. http://langansbrasserie.com/ I think Odins might have closed. That will get you started. To be honest, once you start drinking at the Toucan and the Blues Bar, you will never be seen again. I didn't get out of there for five years!

So sad to hear you've only read a third of my ramblings

I'll just add why your code does not work, as you'd expected it: If you echo a variable in php it's first forced to be converted to a string type, because objects can't be echo'd. A page-object defaults to convert to the page id. In your $pages->get($something) call theres no conversion happening like before, that's why there's nothing found. The method $pages->get() either expectes a id in form of an integer or a selector in form of a string, the page object is neither of both. echo $pages->get($supplier)->supp_check_in; // nothing happens, because there's an object provided echo $pages->get(1234)->supp_check_in; // it works, because there's an integer provided echo $pages->get((int)$supplier)->supp_check_in; // works, too, because the object is first converted to an integer

Now after working quite a while with it, the only thing what is bother me a bit is that when I hide the left menubar by clciking the hamburger-icon and save a page, it is visible again. It should remember the last state and only should change back when clicking again the hamburger icon. Otherwise really love and use many of the features!

Hi Gideon So, Welcome to ProcessWire and the forums. Have a read here: https://processwire.com/talk/topic/6417-processwire-profields-table/?p=63119

Welcome to PW and the forums palacios000. Your $supplier is in PHP terms an object. With that, you have all attributes of that object at your disposal; its id, name, title, parent, children, when it was created - everything . So all you need to do is, e.g. echo $supplier->title; //or echo $supplier->supp_check_in;//No need to do the $pages->get(1234) again. Here I assume I assume blng_supplier is a single page field. If it is a multiple page field, you would have to loop through it..

The Module Blog for ProcessWire replicates and extends the popular Blog Profile. Blog is now in version 2. Please read the README in the Github link below in its entirety before using this module As of 20 December 2017 ProcessWire versions earlier than 3.x are not supported Blog Documentation is here (Work in Progress!) See this post for new features in version 2 or the readme in GitHub. To upgrade from version 1, see these instructions. ################################################## Most of the text below refers to Blog version 1 (left here for posterity). Blog version 1 consists of two modules: ProcessBlog: Manage Blog in the backend/Admin. MarkupBlog: Display Blog in the frontend. Being a module, Blog can be installed in both fresh and existing sites. Note, however, that presently, ProcessBlog is not compatible with existing installs of the Blog Profile. This is because of various structural and naming differences in respect of Fields, Templates, Template Files and Pages. If there is demand for such compatibility, I will code a separate version for managing Blog Profile installs. In order to use the 'Recent Tweets Widget', you will need to separately install and setup the module 'MarkupTwitterFeed'. Please read the README in the Github link below in its entirety before using this module (especially the bit about the Pages, etc. created by the module). I'll appreciate Beta testers, thanks! Stable release works fine. Download Modules Directory: http://modules.processwire.com/modules/process-blog/ Github: https://github.com/kongondo/Blog You can also install from right within your ProcessWire install. Screenshots (Blog version 1) Video Demos ProcessBlog MarkupBlog Credits Ryan Cramer The Alpha Testers and 'Critics' License GPL2

TextformatterMakeLinks This Textformatter module is just a wrapper around the method fHTML::makeLinks from flourishlib (http://flourishlib.com/api/fHTML#makeLinks) The following description is basically just slightly modified copy from the official flourishlib documetation (http://flourishlib.com/docs/fHTML): The Textformatter will parse through a string and create HTML links out of anything that resembles a URL or email address, as long as it is not already part of an tag. Here is an example of it in action: If you put this text into a textarea inputfield which uses this textformatter Example 1: www.example.com. Example 2: https://example.com.'>https://example.com. Example 3: john@example.com. Example 4: ftp://john:password@example.com.'>ftp://john:password@example.com. Example 5: www.example.co.uk. Example 6: john@example.co.uk. Example 7: <a href="http://example.com">http://example.com</a>. The output would be: Example 1: <a href="http://www.example.com">www.example.com</a>. Example 2: <a href="https://example.com">https://example.com</a>. Example 3: <a href="mailto:john@example.com">john@example.com</a>. Example 4: <a href="ftp://john:password@example.com">ftp://john:password@example.com</a>. Example 5: <a href="http://www.example.co.uk">www.example.co.uk</a>. Example 6: <a href="mailto:john@example.co.uk">john@example.co.uk</a>. Example 7: <a href="http://example.com">http://example.com</a>. Downloadhttps://github.com/phlppschrr/TextformatterMakeLinks http://modules.processwire.com/modules/textformatter-make-links/

In one way I don't think there is any right or wrong here. It is just about which way each person wants to use and view Processwire and in which capacity together with each persons view of where they would like to see Processwire go in the future. I am probably just too greedy and want Processwire to be everything because I can see the endless possibilities and at it's core it is simply the best.

@lisandi I don't agree with all of what you wrote but I do think you made some valid points which should be listened to. Regarding themes: I do think there is a need a and a space for this whatever anyone says here. I have listened to the pros and cons and understand both sides but the positives of a theme system far out way the negatives in my opinion. I know any html/css theme can be integrated into processwire with a bit of work but a theming system could still be hugely beneficial for Processwire and it's status and it's users. Nico was working on something down this route which can be found here: https://processwire.com/talk/topic/7236-wirethemes/ and really good luck to him on that project. I love processwire to bits but am finding myself a little envious of the options that are available for wordpress such as woocommerce and a huge array of themes. Admittedly I am tempted sometimes to use Wordpress for certain projects that need ecommerce with other basic cms features that wordpress can provide. For me no theming system and lack of a decent e-commerce system like woocommerce for wordpress are my biggest issues with Processwire. I don't generally use themes but there are occasions when they can be useful to work from especially if a client is on a limited budget. Regarding ecommerce:I know that apeisa was working on some ecommerce modules but I am a little confused about how this will be licenced as I wrote here:https://processwire....apeisa/?p=77734 It would be great to see an open source plugin/module like woocommerce for Processwire with optional premium add-ons. I understand that if someone wants features such as wordpress then they can use Wordpress but i see no reason why Processwire can't be adapted to cater for all. I know that some here will disagree with me but I think there are valid concerns for later down the road for Processwire if it doesn't adapt and open up a little, as in the fast changing word of the web it is easy to get left behind.

Hi lisandi, while I support your effort to discuss matters of user friendliness, please note that the matter "PW compared to Joomla, WP, XYZ etc." has been discussed a zillion times. So, I think this question has the potential to distract from what you originally intended. Better leave it to threads that already exist.

Ah, yes, that changes things I haven't really used repeaters, but I think this might work - just treat each repeater item like a page: <?php $entries = wire('pages')->find("template=story"); foreach ($entries as $entry) { echo "<br>Checking checkbox on {$entry->title}...<br>"; foreach ($entry->tests as $test) { if ($test->old_check == 1) { $test->of(false); $test->new_check = 1; $test->save(); echo "Converted {$test->scenario}<br>"; } } }

Firstly, the $session->password will never work, because I am not using eval to pass the contents of the email, but rather using the {} as a replacement mechanism. The problem with getting a password manually entered via the API was that I was using the InputfieldPassword::processInput hook to grab the password before it is encoded. This won't be triggered when the password is set via the API. I just committed an update that uses the Password::setPass hook instead and it seems to be working well in all scenarios, including setting the password via the API. Could you please test and let me know if that fixes things for you?

This should be pretty easy to do using some code that calls the API <?php $entries = wire('pages')->find("template=entry, old_check=1"); foreach ($entries as $entry) { $entry->of(false); echo "Checking new checkbox on {$entry->title}...<br>"; $entry->new_check = 1; $entry->save(); } The logic is: find all pages that have the old checkbox checked, check the new one, and save the changes. You could put that in a template file, run it once by visiting a page using that template, and then removing the code. Just remember to change the values for template and checkbox fields to reflect the actual ones you use on your site

Maintenance Update @jlahijani, the bug is fixed. Issue was exact as you described ! Added the template name to the JSON object ( for ProcessPageEdit process) Made the 'Include theme based files' conditional (PW >= 2.5.0) Fixed the empty Theme based files field notes (config settings) Fixed a view typos

I think there may be a small bug with this plugin. Let's say you do a fresh install of PW (and use the default admin theme). Then you install Admin Custom Files and check "Include theme based files" and set the folder as "AdminCustomFiles". Then uou create the folder "AdminCustomFiles" in your /site/ folder and then create a css file called AdminThemeDefault.css, and let's say you modify it so #masthead{background:red !important} It doesn't load the file. I think I know the reason... When using the default admin theme without any other admin theme installed, PW doesn't allow the option to switch admin themes per user. As a result, even though you are using the default admin theme, it's not specifically SET. Therefore, to work around this, you have to install another admin theme (like Reno), which then allows you to choose which admin theme a user can have when editing a user. After specifically setting the admin theme to default, only then does the "AdminThemeDefault.css" load. Let me know if what I stated is clear, repeatable and/or if you need a video demonstration. Jonathan

yep all kind of things. Best bet, you enable Theme based files, and use this for colors etc. (p.s. I don't like it that you remove the logo, be proud to use ProcessWire instead )

if anybody stumbles over this thread, here is the correct function (also gebeer's version has got a $text/$summary bug): function truncateText($text, $maxlength = 200) { // truncate to max length $text = substr(strip_tags($text), 0, $maxlength); // check if we've truncated to a spot that needs further truncation if(strlen(rtrim($text, ' .!?,;')) == $maxlength) { // truncate to last word $text = substr($text, 0, strrpos($text, ' ')); } return trim($text); } thank you ryan

Ryan, I'm helping to change that where I can. I'm sure everyone I know is sick of my PW evangelism.