Is ACF WP's way to make it more like PW?

[baymarketingco 8]

Hi,

I'm slowly but surely digging into PHP. I am STILL stuck on WordPress, since I'm comfortable with it. I've mapped out somewhat of a journey to becoming a coding expert (which is a long road, I realise).

I've recently started using Advanced Custom Fields, an excellent plugin for creating custom post types in WordPress.

Then I got to thinking, this plugin seems to give WordPress functionality to act as what I see ProcessWire does out of the box.

A thought:

• Don't consider this an insignificant thought, since I think that, if I've got it right, it would make it much easier to jump straight into PW.

This is how I see it:

• You create a custom field group, specifically for output used for a custom post type. ACF allows for this in WP. I think PW has custom fields built in, since each page is basically a whole made up of custom fields.
• You then need to create a custom template to output those fields.
  • If I'm right, this is where PW by FAR outshines WP, since it allows you to create the template using straightforward HTML and PHP, without having to learn an additional layer of functions.
• If needs be, you create a template to handle archive material, or to showcase posts in a portfolio fashion.
  • WP makes use of the custom loop, which is probably the product's greatest strength. I can't imagine PW having something powerful to hook into (and of course, I could be wrong, and most probably am). This is thus something that I'd need to consider when jumping from WP to PW.

But then, what could also be confusing in PW is that a page could simply be a small sliver of code that could be used repetitively in a PW website.

One concern I have about PW is that, if you need something really bespoke, such as (eg) a calendar or online shop capability, you'd need to build it all by yourself in JS, PHP, MySQL (or whatever). There are no plugins for this type of thing.

Do I have it correct?

Just thinking out loud.

[cb2004 215]

After using both I would comment that Wordpress (core) combined with Advanced Custom Fields (module) is just like Processwire (core), but Processwire is by far the better system. Come and join us over at Processwire, you wont be sorry. With a super friendly and helpful community, on top of a feature rich content management framework, you can build what you like. There is no need for a calendar module in my eyes, you can create a calendar and hook it up with Processwire pages with ease. Ecommerce there are some modules floating about, but this completely depends on what you need. If a full ecommerce system is required it is best left to that type of system, simple systems can be done with Padloper.

*I have only been using Processwire for around a month full time on one site, and I wish I found it years ago.

[LostKobrakai 5,207]

You're mostly correct. 

About the WP Loop comes this to my mind: http://www.designer-daily.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/08/query_functions.jpg. ProcessWire simple uses php functions like foreach, implode, explode and since a few versions special convenience functions WireArray::implode & WireArray::explode, which work similar to their php counterparts but look a little cleaner. No need for a strange loop object if you can simply iterate everything thats at least array like or even an array.

Regarding the calendar / ecommerce thing. It's true that there aren't many ready made plugins out there, but at least for ecommerce it may even be better to use a dedicated ecommerce cms. 

[tpr 3,235]

ProcessWire is a tool that in most cases overperforms other similar softwares in many aspects. According to your actual project, PW may fit in or not. Even if not, I would recommend you to check for other solutions and use WP only if you have strong reasons (or your boss has, of course ).

If your goal is to become a coding expert, WP is definitely NOT the way to go.

[MatthewSchenker 742]

Greetings,

Yes, it's true that custom fields is often cited as a top advantage of ProcessWire, and having this capability does make ProcessWire better than most other CMSs right from the start.  However, custom fields is just the surface of what makes ProcessWire so special.  Honestly, superficially, you can get custom fields with a plugin for  WordPress or Joomla or Drupal.

But with ProcessWire there's more to it than just creating fields:

• A crystal-clear API for deep querying of data (your fields) in almost any way you can imagine.
• It allows you to advance your core knowledge of PHP, then use that knowledge directly.  You don't have to learn a weird way to implement PHP (i.e., make use of those fields).
• The system handles the above two points with impressive speed.

There are numerous other advantages to using ProcessWire.  These are just a few that are directly related to custom fields.

Thanks,

Matthew

[Sephiroth 376]

Hmmmmm maybe i should write an indepth article for developers comparing the two, because as a former avid WordPress developer, i wish i found PW earlier. My PHP5 Skills are highly put to the test, ave extended PW to insane limits and it's totally awesome. check my forum how to accomplish this feat  i document my adventures there

[baymarketingco 8]

Thanks for all the feedback guys.

I'm hoping to jump in soon.

I've actually considered PW superior for many years. Thing is, just knowing that something is superior does not mean you know how to harness that superiority. You work with what you can, until such a time as you're comfortable to move to the next thing.

Thanks again. Many blessings!

[dragan 1,729]

At my job I was forced to use Wordpress for a recent project (wasn't my decision of course). We had to use ACF Pro, and let me tell you - in terms of rendering time / flexibility, and performance, ACF is a mess. In a debug report, I found that 2/3 of the performance loss was created by the ACF plugin. Some pages use over 130 queries and take up to 2 seconds to render. The whole WP architecture is just not made for custom-tailored sites, and I still don't agree when some people actually call it a CMS; to me, it's an article management system. (but maybe I digress - there's a big WP thread elsewhere that covers all of that)

oh - also.... ACF created a whopping 40k records in the wp_postmeta table. For a relatively small website (local business). wtf?

[baymarketingco 8]

A question, while I have everyone's attention: is it possible to install PW in a subfolder, and have the site run in root?

[Martijn Geerts 3,254]

Yep, thats possible.

ps, I like the beard !

[baymarketingco 8]

Beautiful. I mean, not you, Martijn, but that it runs in root. 

[Martijn Geerts 3,254]

Dude, That's Rude!

[baymarketingco 8]

Het is een klein grapje, Martijn. Je bent werkelijk schitterend. 

[renobird 2,045]

bloomie,

Take the plunge! There are a lot of helpful folks here that will chime in to assist you when needed.

[baymarketingco 8]

renobird, I'm going to. Just sat now and decided to use it on one of my domains, africanfishing.net, as a test project. First have to finish off one or two other WP sites that are 90 percent done, but then I'll slowly but surely start working on the .net site.

Thanks!

[tpr 3,235]

Haha, 90% done? Read this

http://andyadams.org/90-projects-and-wordpress/

[renobird 2,045]

Glad to hear it.  

[Pierre-Luc 410]

ACF can sometimes feel like it gives WP superpower abilities, but under the hood it is a big, big hack. 

All fields stored in the database use the same table, most often serialized. This caused me big issues lately when doing a migration.

Also, their API isn't that robust (case in point, I've been exchanging with ACF support lately, I'm finding lots of "should work, sorry"). To me robustness means things won't explode when approaching edge cases.. it's clearly not it.. especially if I pay for it.

As has been said, every time you call a field with the_field(), a DB call is made. This obviously taxes your server's ressource, and the problem grows exponentially when the project you're on won't allow for caching.

Managing content relationships in ACF is far from ideal either, if you ask me.

All in all, it might kind of feel similar UI-wise, but the architecture is lacking, all due to the DB schema limitations in WP itself.

[dragan 1,729]

Oh, don't get me started on their relationship input fields - it's a mess. You can't configure it to only show children of one certain parent, thus making it a pita to scroll down until you can make a selection (the lazyload thingie inside the dropdown makes it even worse).

[Sephiroth 376]

At my job I was forced to use Wordpress for a recent project (wasn't my decision of course). We had to use ACF Pro, and let me tell you - in terms of rendering time / flexibility, and performance, ACF is a mess. In a debug report, I found that 2/3 of the performance loss was created by the ACF plugin. Some pages use over 130 queries and take up to 2 seconds to render. The whole WP architecture is just not made for custom-tailored sites, and I still don't agree when some people actually call it a CMS; to me, it's an article management system. (but maybe I digress - there's a big WP thread elsewhere that covers all of that)

oh - also.... ACF created a whopping 40k records in the wp_postmeta table. For a relatively small website (local business). wtf?

That's small am gonna show you a picture of my database of the post_meta fields for a site of 200 memebers am surprised how come we got so many post_meta, My PW database size is tons far less than my ex wordpress site. Wordpress is not a CMS i agree

[diogo 4,743]

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