kickstarter for ProcessWire Modules

[Martijn Geerts]

kickstarter

There are several developers here that contribute a lot, working for fun and sharing knowledge giving us wonderful modules. 

But next to the respect they get, it would be nice we pay for the Cola & Pizza's they need while programming.

( Can hungry programmers code to ? )

For me as individual I won't/can't pay a decent price for good software, but with 10 members things change.

Say: If an developer needs $750,- before starting the write. (I'ts only €56,-- per person, not reached, money back )

Then: Every person who paid, can download the finished module. 

After 3 months: The module becomes normal opensource, available for everyone.

Maybe Ryan can choose some privileged developers that are capable of building quality modules.

What do you think ?

[owzim]

What I can see as problematic here is, that modules grow an flourish just because very early versions are shared from the beginning making them open to suggestions and bug reports, which is a very important aspect of open source.

If you limit the audience just to the people who pay, modules may not become as awesome and user friendly, at least not in early stages. That's just a thought. In general I like the idea very much.

[Martijn Geerts]

I don't want to limit the audience. The social aspect is important. But if someone pays, he should deserve something extra.

I love to see the source will be open after 3 months or so.

[renobird]

Martijn,

This is a good topic. I would be open to contributing (without extra consideration) to module development — especially if the idea was well documented.

We would need something like Kickstarter, so contributers would get refunded if the goal wasn't reached.

[onjegolders]

Why not the people who are sponsoring just do so out of interest to see the project flourish? I agree with Owzim, a big part of Open Source is getting it thoroughly tested and transparent.

If the module was right, I'd be happy to contribute and would be OK with others benefitting.

[horst]

As I can see both sides and maybe some more facettes, I like this:
 

But if you are wondering how we ultimately get paid to develop ProcessWire: we get paid by the sites and applications we build with it. ProcessWire lets us build more capable sites, more than twice as fast as we could elsewhere. That means we can invest that extra time in ProcessWire itself… which in turn benefits the other projects we work on. It’s a win-win cycle. I also think it’s a real benefit that everyone developing for ProcessWire also develops [other projects] with ProcessWire in their day job. We are all everyday users of the product we develop.

 
taken from here, the answer to question number 5) 

[Martijn Geerts]

@horst, I do understand what Ryan said, wise words, and I agree. ( aside, more likely to expect an interview with Ryan Trash over there )

The kickstarter thing is in essence not about earning money. It's about sharing ideas, make plans and work it out, together. Let the kickstarter feel like they're part of the community an let them help to create useful modules/apps. In the end the community will benefit from it. 

[Peter Falkenberg Brown]

Dear All,

I like the idea, but one thing (I think) is that Kickstarter doesn't accept projects outside the USA, while

http://indiegogo.com does. Indiegogo also doesn't have the stringent project acceptance requirements that

Kickstarter has, so it would be easier to start with Indiegogo.

Also, IndieGogo allows a person to collect funds even if the goal is not reached, which in the case

of the modules might be good. It's better to get something than nothing, and the module will still be available.

I also think that the software would benefit from early release and feedback.

How 'bout this?

- Indiegogo Project to Create XYZ Module

- Goal, $Some dollars

- Perks based on dollar amounts:

     . $5  - listed on web page as Donor

     . $10 - listed on web page as Helpful Donor

     . $25 - listed on web page as Very Helpful Donor

... etc, etc.

Indiegogo works via perks, as Kickstarter does, but with the software being free,

the perks might just as well be a mention on a web page. There's no requirement otherwise.

And then, as the campaign progresses, the software updates can be posted.

The campaign can be fashioned with complete freedom, so the "usual method" can be easily tweaked.

Campaigns can be up to 120 days. The main thing is that all of the money isn't released (I think) until the

date is reached.

Peter

[Macrura]

no need to have donors get anything special... just a way to crowd-fund some module development...

Donor listing would be good, and the donors and their websites could be listed on the module page, and in the module credits, based on donation amount..

[Marty Walker]

There were a few textpattern plugins released via 'ransom' - a custom fields one too if I remember correctly (hilarious!) - which went along the lines of 'I need this much money and I'll release it'. Personally if I was putting money towards module development I'd have no problem letting everyone get the benefit of it.

I'm still blown away by not only the generosity of Ryan releasing ProcessWire but the dozens of module devs here that have made my life as site builder that much easier. Perhaps another approach would be to have a PayPal donate button (or similar) in the existing modules section where folk can send their cash to.

[onjegolders]

Well said Marty.

[Beluga]

Perhaps these would be more appropriate for small gigs:

http://catincan.com/

https://www.bountysource.com/

http://freedomsponsors.org/

Or even http://www.crowdhoster.com/

[Peter Falkenberg Brown]

Dear Marty,

I like the idea of donating to Ryan's efforts. With PayPal donations / subscriptions, it's very easy.

There is also power in numbers, i.e. if a hundred people donate $2.50 a month, that's $250 per month,

which is better than a sharp stick in the eye.

Of course, many can donate more than $2.50 a month, but in tough economic times, it's good to give

people the option of a "micro-donation", rather than the choice of "donate $50 or nothing."

I have an example of this process on my website, here:

http://significatojournal.com/patron

At the bottom of the page, a person can choose various levels of monthly donations,

or choose to make a one-time donation, as a "Renaissance Patron."

I think that if Ryan set up something like that, many of us here would donate at least $2.50 a month.

Peter

[Marty Walker]

Hi Peter,

Indeed. Something like that could be a good option too. Even some of the smallest of modules would save me more than $2.50 in time over the span of a month.

- Marty

[Martijn Geerts]

Although small donations PayPall like things for ProcessWire I love to see. But the reason I started this topic is that Avoine, (the company where Apeisa works) was so generous to give their investment back to the community. We all benefit.

I'm on this forum in free time for fun and I'm on this forum getting things done for the company I work for. The first part, (free me ) love to be involved in things where the ProcessWire community benifits. There are plenty of great developers here, sharing, writing, making PW the best place for me to be on the web.

What if we work out ideas, having fun and let the build begin. Developers don't have to do all things free. The little bit payment can just be a motivator. (they actualy they deserve). And for me (the free) don't want to get the guilty feeling of leeching.

[apeisa]

For us it is pure business: it is great to have possibility to buy (or support) development from outside of our company. To get it directly from Ryan is great bonus. To share it open source and make ProcessWire even better is of course superb. The better and more popular ProcessWire is, the stronger our development framework is.

It would be great to see fundraising projects for module development. Building open source modules is fun, and I don't believe anyone hates the idea to make few bucks at the same time.

But I think there are plenty of real money making opportunities coming now that ProcessWire is gaining more popularity: paid modules, paid profiles, site building, paid support, books, learning videos / tutorials, consulting... Currently PW has still relatively small audience, so I don't believe any module or book can get super high sales. But this is growing audience and very little competition. I would love to see more people trying to make money this way.

[diogo]

Honestly, I think it's a bit soon for considering this. I can certainly make a one to one relation with the time that I spend here helping people (two modules and one language pack are not very impressive to refer ) and the working time that I economize because I use PW and not another tool for my work. I feel that I owe so much to Ryan and to this project (community included *), that I wouldn't try to get a compensation for contributing in the present or in a near future. If someone deserves a compensation for all his time, that someone is Ryan**, and he told already that he wants to get it from his payed modules and not through donations.

* I may not ask lots of questions, but I profit a lot in silence from the answers to questions that others make

** I feel that I should open an exception to refer Soma also. The work he has already done for PW is huge (https://flattr.com/profile/philipp.urlich)

[onjegolders]

Honestly, I think it's a bit soon for considering this. I can certainly make a one to one relation with the time that I spend here helping people (two modules and one language pack are not very impressive to refer ) and the working time that I economize because I use PW and not another tool for my work. I feel that I owe so much to Ryan and to this project (community included *), that I wouldn't try to get a compensation for contributing in the present or in a near future. If someone deserves a compensation for all his time, that someone is Ryan**, and he told already that he wants to get it from his payed modules and not through donations.

* I may not ask lots of questions, but I profit a lot in silence from the answers to questions that others make

** I feel that I should open an exception to refer Soma also. The work he has already done for PW is huge (https://flattr.com/profile/philipp.urlich)

*** You too mister!

[Soma]

Too kind of you diogo! 

[totoff]

If someone deserves a compensation for all his time, that someone is Ryan**, and he told already that he wants to get it from his payed modules and not through donations.

Unfortunately there is no easy answer on how to give something back for such a brilliant piece of open source software. To be honest, though I don't know the context in which Ryan that this about donations, I can understand his position. Receiving donations is something completely different compared to getting paid for your hard work ...

I'm benefiting commercially from PW and my clients do as well (I always point this out by the way when it comes to price discussions - most clients don't waste thoughts on where the software is coming from and why it is free for them. They think it's "just there".). So, if it comes to forms I make form builder module mandatory and currently I'm thinking about making cache module mandatory with every new project too. But this will hardly be enough for Ryan to make a living from.

Hmm,  could we make a foundation, that lives from donations and that acts as sponsor for new modules which are developed by Ryan? Say, everybody who uses PW commercially contributes with a certain percentage of the project budget to the foundation and the foundation in return pays Ryan a good price for new modules. Would this work?

As I said, I have no final solution. But I can say that I would be willing to contribute with money. Whether it's by paying for modules or by becoming a contributor to the PW foundation.