OrganizedFellow Posted October 27, 2014 Author Share Posted October 27, 2014 I don't even know why you're so worried about switching from CMS a to CMS b. It's not you're rebuilding his old site. You're making a new site for him (or did I miss something?). Was he specifically asking you to build the first site with EE? In the end, you built a website, with whatever tools you've chosen at the time. Simply build his 2nd site now with whatever CMS you decide to use. If he even mentions something like "why a different backend this time?", list your arguments then. Everyone should know by now that our business is very fast-paced. Tools come and go, get better or worse; c'est la vie. He'll even be thankful you were trying to avoid costs for him in the long run (EE support), and as a business guy he'll appreciate that. I wouldn't mention that you probably would have to update lots of stuff for his old EE site - he could think that you didn't do your duty in the last two years and start to worry now. I also wouldn't mention that you would have to get up-to-date with EE, since that could be misread as "he doesn't care about keeping up-to-date as a developer". You make lots of excellent points. I don't even know why you're so worried about switching from CMS a to CMS b. It's not you're rebuilding his old site. You're making a new site for him (or did I miss something?). I will be rebuilding his old site, hence my dilemma. Should I build the new site with ProcessWire, and rebuild the old one (responsive) with EE? That means two different logins. Should I build both sites in ProcessWire? Should I rebuild the old site with EE and the new one both in EE? He has a license! But what about support costs? They seem high! ProcessWire has the most helpful community I have ever been a part of. He's hiring ME because I possess skills that he does not, and skills he could not find in any others. I do know for a fact that he had another developer working for him after I finished the site two years ago. All I know is that he is no longer around. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joss Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 To be honest, this sounds more like a budget issue than anything else: So, what is the cost of rebuilding the original site in EE (allowing for the fact it is already in EE and allowing for any licencing issues) What is the cost of building a replacement site for the original in ProcessWire? What is the cost of building the new site in EE including any licencing? What is the cost of building the new site in EE? From the little I know about EE, it seems that it is possibly less work to build in PW - though I may have that very wrong! Once you work out the cost, you can then do a proper comparison. If the price works out similar, then just announce you will do it all in PW. If it is more expensive to transition to PW, but still feel he should have both built in PW, then you need to make the operational case (don't worry him with technology). So, "it will be better to spend the extra money because....." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrganizedFellow Posted October 27, 2014 Author Share Posted October 27, 2014 To be honest, this sounds more like a budget issue than anything else. Not really a budget issue. I've only worked on several projects OFFline, on my local dev server, learning ProcessWire, its modules, etc. I have yet to launch a site WITH ProcessWire. So this would be my first one. NO, actually, second. My first should launch in the coming week. So not an issue with budget, I'm just "still" battling the complexities in my head. Often times, I over analyze things and break things down. I'm better off just JUMPING IN HEAD FIRST and get it going and all the pieces fall into place. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onjegolders Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I loved EE until I met PW. PW is basically a better, more flexible version of EE, that happens to be Open Source as well. Client has nothing to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazzyweb Posted October 27, 2014 Share Posted October 27, 2014 I don't know the differences between EE and Processwire but maybe someone that has experience in both could write out a pros and cons list. EE vs Processwire. That might be enough to convince client. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrganizedFellow Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 I don't know the differences between EE and Processwire but maybe someone that has experience in both could write out a pros and cons list. EE vs Processwire. That might be enough to convince client. I had used EE for years, way back when they were still called pMachine. So I have a firm understanding of the CMS. However I have not used it in the past two years, and I am sure lots has changed. I loved EE until I met PW. PW is basically a better, more flexible version of EE, that happens to be Open Source as well. Client has nothing to lose. Same here! I loved EE until I had the "EUREKA MOMENT" with ProcessWire. It took a long time for me, because after leaving EE, I was on the hunt for the next great CMS. That got me into various WAMP setups, virtual machines, a dozen different CMS's, etc. I liked many others, but none gave me the AHAAA MOMENT, like a lightning bolt, as PW did the first time I understood it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onjegolders Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 What drew me to PW was the similarities in fact with EE. But where EE was frustrating me with seemingly required paid addons and an unsure future, ProcessWire just seemed to take all that was good about it and improve it massively. Everything just seems so *sensibly* thought-out. The big stumbling point was the "everything is pages" approach, which makes development so much easier now but did (and still does occasionally) cause some scratching of the head. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrganizedFellow Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 EE was frustrating me with seemingly required paid addons and an unsure future 101% AGREED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Knight Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 On the National Geographic case study, I found it interesting that the developers moved the whole site to ProcessWire in the background and *then* brought this up with the client. Had they asked if they could move from Drupal to PW, the answer would likely have been negative. Perhaps a risky strategy for some but as my old boss once said: "Ask for forgiveness. Don't ask for permission" 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teppo Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 The big stumbling point was the "everything is pages" approach, which makes development so much easier now but did (and still does occasionally) cause some scratching of the head. It's funny how it goes: in Drupal (almost) all content items are Nodes, which feels absolutely nonsensical and confusing to me, but I've never heard people say that they don't "get" it. Pages, on the other hand, seem to confuse many newcomers, even though the bulk of the content they manage in ProcessWire are exactly that -- pages. Personally I prefer pages over nodes, and perhaps even resources (from MODX) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrganizedFellow Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 (edited) On the National Geographic case study, I found it interesting that the developers moved the whole site to ProcessWire in the background and *then* brought this up with the client. Had they asked if they could move from Drupal to PW, the answer would likely have been negative. Perhaps a risky strategy for some but as my old boss once said: "Ask for forgiveness. Don't ask for permission" I love it! I will absolutely without a doubt follow this idea! Thanks Peter Night! -- Edit by diogo: had to happen one day... @OrganizedFellow, sorry, I erased your post instead of replying. I tried to put it back how it was, but I'm not sure it's exactly the same Edited October 28, 2014 by diogo messed up the post 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diogo Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 I will absolutely without a doubt follow this idea! Edit: by the way, just noticed I messed your post. See above 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OrganizedFellow Posted October 28, 2014 Author Share Posted October 28, 2014 Edit by diogo: had to happen one day... @OrganizedFellow, sorry, I erased your post instead of replying. I tried to put it back how it was, but I'm not sure it's exactly the same Fortunately for me, I was able to get a screen capture before you edited your post 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joss Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 There is another side to this community which transcends anything ever found on slashdot. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Peter Knight Posted October 28, 2014 Share Posted October 28, 2014 There is another side to this community which transcends anything ever found on slashdot.Agree. I think you're all nuts. Thankfully I'm not allergic to nuts. Here's another thing my old boss used to say to me : "Pete me auld flower. That's not just allowed. That's in fact encouraged". Stay nuts 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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